Culture

Was Independence Day A Mistake?

I have attended my fair share of Independence Day celebrations. Of course, the holiday is now simply referred to as “4th of July,” not really “Independence Day” anymore and the parties are a bit basic. In college, its an excuse to day drink while dressed up in American-themed clothes, which is a lot of fun. You go on the rooftops towards the evening to see the fireworks. Most people only see them through the screen of their phones nowadays, but the experience is nice nonetheless…

At least it used to be. The university started cracking down on parties quite heavily my last two years there, and all of a sudden every rooftop suddenly had a campus police presence. They would periodically haul away enthusiastic partygoers who clambered up on chairs for a better view or who started to drink openly while waiting for the fireworks to start.

I had done quite a bit of traveling by the time that my last college 4th of July celebration came around. I was more pessimistic about the whole affair. America was about FREEDUMS. I knew this because I had heard about it my entire life. But Eastern Europe struck me as being much freer than where I was now. And worse, many of my classmates had gotten quite fat, especially the girls. Four years of drinking beer and then chowing down to sober up had taken its toll. The constant security everywhere and the diversity of the student body seemed to have increased since my first year. Or perhaps I had simply started to notice it more after being in Eastern Europe…

I was suddenly in an evenly White/non-White split while on the rooftop, waiting for the fireworks. My classmates would crowd around each other like penguins to take quick concealed swigs while the fat black police officers were prowling around. I had a thought then and there that this was a perfect metaphor for life in America now: surrounded by Diversity and ugliness, all while under the baleful eye of a hostile surveillance state.

It’s not pretty, but to be honest, that’s what the United States has come to mean for me over the years.

And more and more, I began to doubt the importance of the holiday considering where the United States finds itself today.

Just think about the historical significance of independence. After a brief war, followed by a century of simmering hostility, the American people became fast friends with the British again. Bismark remarked at the end of the 19th century that the most significant event of the 20th century would be “The fact that the North Americans speak English”.

He was right. After a war for independence, the Americans found that they all of a sudden had more in common with the British than the Germans and Italians when World War I came around and then when World War II came around as well. Of course, the story behind America’s entry into both of those wars is complicated and worth an entire post of its own, so we’ll leave it for another time.

But after all that time pretending to be friends with France, and not wanting to get involved in European wars, America sided with the same power that had burned down the White House one hundred years prior.

Today, the former colonies all work together. In fact, the Anglosphere has probably never been more united. Canada, New Zealand, Australia, and the UK all work together and get along famously.

Is this not proof of the importance of blood and culture? Despite all the beefs that could have been had between these countries, they instead ended up drifting back closer to each other as grudges began to fade. And wouldn’t that make sense?

What is wrong with the Anglos working together, pursuing their own civilization, and creating a sort of unofficial Anglosphere? And following that train of logic, what is wrong with Slavs incorporating fellow Slavs into one larger civilizational block? What about the Germans in northern Europe?

In my mind, this could become be the final and most stable structure of the White World: a consolidation into ethnic blocs. But here is where I started having doubts. Perhaps we weren’t taking into account the American experience?

See, the Alt-Right gets criticized for being too wild-eyed and optimistic about a sort of pan-European peoples union to emerge out of the patchwork that is the White World as it is now. I too have my doubts about the viability of the project because of the differences among White cultures. But it is an optimism that is born out of the American experience, and I believe that it is the greatest single defining feature of American civilization. It’s why White Nationalism was born in the United States, not Europe. The American experiment proved that European people could live and work together in peace without constant bloodletting between Poles and Germans, Italians and Anglos, Irish and Hungarian.

And while I look around at American culture now with disgust, I can’t help but feel that America was a worthwhile project after all if it could prove that White people really do have more in common than not.

And so, on this Fourth of July, while I sit as an expat in the Old World, I choose to celebrate the America that almost no one else sees, the America that could have been and frankly still could be. And it is a celebration that I hope all European peoples will someday celebrate as well. While those fireworks go off in the name of “Liberty” or some other empty abstraction now, those of us on the Alt-Right can take comfort in knowing that someday, those fireworks might go off in the name of White brotherhood, solidarity, and friendship worldwide.

We celebrate Independence Day now, but I hope we will celebrate Rapprochement Day in the future.

 

 

Vincent Law
the authorVincent Law
I have a Hatreon now! If you like my writing and want me to write more, consider supporting me there. https://hatreon.net/vlaw/

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180 Comments on "Was Independence Day A Mistake?"

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July should be White History Month.

Brutus of troy
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the whole of the Enlightenment was a mistake

Pareto
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If you’re not Pro WHITE you’re not Alt Right. All of you people claiming “white” is not an identity are in for a big surprise. You’re all old. None of you get it. This is America. We’re WHITE and that’s all we’ve ever been. It’s time for WHITE men to to subordinate “WASPs” and “Scotch-Irish” and “Germans” and everyone else to the WHITE agenda. If you want to be a “WASP” gtfo out of America and go back to England. If you want to be “Scots-Irish” gtfo and go back to Ulster. If you want to be “German” let your… Read more »
Peter
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The American experiment proved that European people could live and work together in peace without constant bloodletting between Poles and Germans, Italians and Anglos, Irish and Hungarian. So the question arises… and it´s the very basis of the multi-culturalists: will that work also with mixing different races together, instead of different ethnicities of one race? There is a most important aspect in this thought: namely, if I assume that it is NOT possible to mix together different races: this IMO shows that race has a meaning of something… maybe the right word would be “metaphysical”. I actually want to say:… Read more »
altright_sobriquet
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repost per disqus: I never understood my WASP family’s ignorance concerning racial and Jewish questions. A dislike / distrust of Blacks and Jews was implicit, but they missed what was taking place perhaps because of the upheaval with Vietnam and the 1960’s counterculture. I would not underestimate the power of the mass media in the 60’s and 70’s – then TV and print. If you look back at the media from the era the shift was subtle, gradual, and couched in moral undertones. This media drove American culture. Assisted by Catholics, it wasn’t until the the late 70’s and 80’s… Read more »
Stonewall Columbus
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Italians, Germans, and Anglo-Saxons make up the best white civilization has to offer. If I had to list them in importance I would go 1) English 2) Italian 3) German. I do believe Italian could have been number one, however the Protestant Reformation not involving them set them behind the last 500 years. After that Germany and England exploded with historically influencial people. Greeks get thrown in for 4th place (Euclid alone gives them the right).

Halford Mackinder
Guest

All the egalitarianism that the alt right is fighting is rooted in the “Reformation”. There would be no idiotic concept of all men being created equal if not for the idiotic concept of men being equally capable of interpreting scripture.

Vitchyovski
Guest
(re post due to d-squs bs) In places like America, people use their race as a proxy for ethnicity because they have lost their ethnic identity. In this sense, many white Americans are in the same boat as black Americans. Neither ‘white’ nor ‘black’ is an ethnicity -they are racial categories, and a racial category contains actual ethnic groups. So for instance, “white” as a racial category would contain the Slavs, Germanics, Latins, Greeks, etc AS WELL AS the de-ethnicized ‘whites’ that use their race as a proxy for ethnicity. It is this last group that seeks to monopolize the… Read more »
Vitchyovski
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Why the hell was my comment “detected as spam” and deleted?

SS
Guest

I can still read but it but it is waiting for some one to review it.Hope that help,s.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

It’s not this site but weird Disqus algorithms. A few months ago it was detecing comments with “Jews” as spam and deleting thim. Daniel Friberg has commented that it is not the Editors here doing this

Vitchyovski
Guest

I see. Should I re-post my comment or is it still visible? Another user said they can still see it but I can’t.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Try copy and pasting with spacing or respelling the word with anything that make flag the comment. For example, I would always type “Juice” instead of “Jews”

Vitchyovski
Guest

Sure, I’ll give it a try. I didn’t even use ((that word))) once in the comment though hah.

SS
Guest

You mean like if i squeeze hipster racist i get “Juice”

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

If you squeeze Hipster Racist you get “Hollywood Nazi Fake Zyklon B” canisters that they used in the seldom trod on genre of Holocaust films. It’s a shame that there are so few Holocaust films these days.

NotYouNotSure
Guest
“I can’t help but feel that America was a worthwhile project after all” I am going to have to utterly disagree with this, America was ultimately what brought about the demise of the white race globally. It was the USA that tipped the balance in the war between the concept of race vs the concept of universal values as being supreme. It was the greatest catastrophe for whites, nothing else comes remotely close. It is easy for me to criticize America because I am not American, but any American here should ask the question “what is more important to me,… Read more »
craicher
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Very true. I say that as an American and am ashamed of the White genocide the USA has been at since 1861. My ancestors fought and died to stop it in the War of Northern Aggression.

Charles The Hammer
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The outcome of the world wars would likely not have been any different had the United States never been created. The British Empire still would have used American colonists as canon fodder and used its vast natural resources for the war effort. 18th century Britain was already heavily influenced by Enlightenment thought before the US ever existed. The idea that Americans rebelled against a tyrannical monarchy is a ludicrous myth that many believe. In fact, Britain already had a representative democracy with Lord North as Prime Minister. The Kind did not have much power. The British elite chose to not… Read more »
Fred
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White Americans must become a single and united nation. Then claim an ethnostate. No other viable alternatives to survive on this continent. Due to the difference in racial conciousness, I am sceptical about the Pan European movement.

Joe Putnam
Guest

I am for friendship and cooperation between sovereign white countries, but I believe those various sovereign white countries should be just that -individual sovereign entities. America “proved” that all whites can get along without fighting with the war that occurred from 1861-65. America should be at least two different white countries, and Dixie has the legal and moral right to be free and totally sovereign. Yes, I am one of those Alt-South boys.
Here is the link to my piece about the Declaration, July 4th, and race realism of the Foudners: https://identitydixie.com/2017/07/04/untaught-truths-about-the-4th-of-july/

Vlad le Putin
Guest

Great article. I think that is a very interesting prospect, perhaps instead of a pan-European society, perhaps, as you said, a slavosphere, an angloshphere, a scandanavian sphere……..would certainly go a long way towards uniting us and fighting our enemies.

SLCain
Guest
America was in many ways the apotheosis of a certain anglo-saxon trait: a heightened sense and valuation of individualism. The people who settled british north-america were perhaps some of the anglo-saxoniest of the anglo-saxons, and carried this trait in abundance. But it has a cost. It too easily turns into a devil-take-the-hindmost attitude – a willingness to beggar your neighbor, your own kin even, to gain a temporary advantage. It expressed itself in the willingness to import slaves in the South, and immigrant wage-slave labor in the North. It is still alive today in the readiness of so many whites… Read more »
Ajudeo
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Inspiring……

Thanks, Vincent……

Being German, Swiss, Polish, English, Scottish, Irish, Welsh………Pan-European……..myself……

……like so many other White Americans……..

We already are the Future…….

Cheers!!

McSwag
Guest

I prefer SW Med countries to the Anglosphere, which is just the domination of the US(and all the shit that goes with it)

Cascadia
Guest
Britain only raised taxes on the colonies to pay the debt incurred protecting them from the French during the Seven Years War. Before that the colonists lived tax free. So it’s like letting your friend crash at your place with no strings attached and then he gets mad because you want him to start chipping in for rent. If we had stayed part of the empire we’d have national healthcare by now, slavery would’ve ended without any violence and large numbers of blacks could’ve been shipped back to Africa, we’d have tradition and monarchy, and Yankee puritanism, radicalism, and liberalism… Read more »
Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Who knows…we could be just as cucked as Canada is. Just because the American Revolution failed does not mean that Enlightenment ideas would not have spread.

Cascadia
Guest

Canada is only as cucked as it is because they rejected their British identity in favor of being more liberal than us. I think you’re right enlightenment ideas would still spread but they’d have a harder time doing so without the existence of a country built on those ideas. Communism would still spread if the Bolshevik Revolution had failed but how powerful would Communism be without the Soviet Union as a home base? Wouldn’t the failure of that revolution have strengthened the old regimes and deomoralized the communists?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

When asked about the impact of the French Revolution, Chou En Lai remarked in 1972 that it was too early to say.

Cascadia
Guest

That was then, this is now. It was a mistake.

Lucas Bullivant
Guest

Cascadia, Chou En Lai(Zhou Enlai) was a major Communist leader, one of Mao’s deputies.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Pinyin is Cucked! Based Wade-Giles.

Johnny Fascismo
Guest

Canada held on to it’s British identity for way longer than the US. It was ony post WWII that Southern and Eastern Europeans started to be welcomed. Then in the 70’s lots of non-white immigration started coming in. Blacks are still only 3-5% of the country. East Asians are the largest non-white group and their only like 12%. It’s still a vast mostly unpopulated country. When I go out East and visit the small towns in Nova Scotia you can go weeks wihout seeing a non-white person.

Hereward
Guest

Yeah I think Canada, like Russia, might be one of the last holdouts if things go badly for white people.

The urban population (where all the non-whites congregate) is packed into the south, and the rest of the country is; a) huge and b) extremely inhospitable

What that should mean is that non-whites (being low agency (assorted muds) or low indvidualism / pioneer spirit (east asians) will be unlikely to move into smaller rural towns further north, and if they do, white people have plenty of room to move furthe North and create new settlements.

Johnny Fascismo
Guest

Exactly. I think when things start getting really bad south of the border due to multiculturalism a lot of Canadians will wake up also and the numbers will still be on our side. Most Canadians are already sick of Trudeau and I don’t see him getting re-elected in 2019. The situation looks worse than it is to those South of the border.

Diversity Heretic
Guest

The tragedy of the United States is that in 1960 the rapprochment described by Vincent Law was close. In another two or three generations (50-75 years) the European-origin peoples in the United States could have “merged” into a coherent nation, basically Anglo-Germanic-Dutch, but with Scandinavian, Southern European and Slavic components. But the decision to try and incorporate African-origin peoples, and to open up immigration to (especially) Mestizos, doomed the project. Like Vincent, I observe Independence Day as an expat slightly depressed over what might have been.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Pat Buchanan has frequently touched on that. By 1960, White America truly was one people, with a common heritage, heroes, and culture. The 1924 Immigration Act allowed time to bring Southern and Eastern Europeans into the White American fold that had largely been Anglo-Irish-German before the 20th Century.

Of course, there were already plenty of Jews who got into America by 1960 and they did and continue to do their best to undermine White America.

Vitchyovski
Guest
In places like America, people use their race as a proxy for ethnicity because they have lost their ethnic identity. In this sense, many white Americans are in the same boat as black Americans. Neither ‘white’ nor ‘black’ is an ethnicity -they are racial categories, and a racial category contains actual ethnic groups. So for instance, “white” as a racial category would contain the Slavs, Germanics, Latins, Greeks, etc AS WELL AS the de-ethnicized ‘whites’ that use their race as a proxy for ethnicity. It is this last group that seeks to monopolize the entire racial category, when in fact… Read more »
Albionic American
Guest

I don’t have that problem because I come from a long line of Anglo-Americans. I can pick up a volume of Shakespeare, Donne or Milton – “authentically,” so to speak, because I can legitimately claim them as my people’s poets.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Same. Founding stock America doesn’t have an issue with ethnic identity. It’s the immigrants that have created the White mish mash we have today.

craicher
Guest

Jews encouraged the Irish and Italians and such to remain as hyphenated Americans.

Vitchyovski
Guest

The hyphen is the line between ethnic life and ethnic death. I’m not an American (Australian here), but there is no way in hell that I would drop my ethnic hyphen and become a generic “Australian”, and if I were an American, likewise. IRL I encourage my Anglo friends to rediscover their own hyphen.

craicher
Guest
That is complicated. Let’s say your ancestors were convicts brought to Australia (or British North America, people forget that one and like to think their ancestors were these brave pioneers) from England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales. Which hyphen should they rediscover? At some point your ancestors also came into whatever land you are from and became the nation that you want to hyphenate. I get your sentiments and I know this up close. My own children have dual nationality. But when we visit America they are Americans. We have our own food, culture, music, mentality, and dare I say language.… Read more »
Vincent Law
Guest

Funny how the WASP elite did this intentionally to destroy Polish, Irish and German communities. They used the Blacks as shock troops and shlomo was willing to lend a helping hand of course.

craicher
Guest

That was also part of another pet project of the WASP elite, Prohibition. The idea being that Celtic Southerners, and Latin, Slavic, and Celtic folks up North were drinking in bars and conspiring against them. They busted up the bars and the organic societies of their rivals all the while selling their daughters to the jews.

Anime Nazi Troll 4000
Guest
Anime Nazi Troll 4000

It’s difficult to re ethnicize one’s self when you are 1/8-1/16 of about 10 different European ethnicities, but I understand and respect your point.

One other problem is that the multi-kulti anti-White enemy doesn’t see ethnicity within Whites (they hate Western culture, people, and heritage, generally, with Whiteness serving as a proxy for all Westernisms). Focusing too heavily on it can cause us to otherize our own race at a time when we need solidarity to simply survive.

unpaidpundit
Guest

I think that the formation of the European Union was an at least unconscious acknowledgement that the people of Europe were a single race, and should cooperate, rather than fight. This was the feeling among the “men in the street,” anyway. Many of the elites may have had different ideas, and today’s elites have perverted the idea of the EU as a home for anyone who can get there.

Albionic American
Guest

Michael Shermer has tweeted about the role of “reason” and “science” in the ideas propounded in the Declaration of Independence. But the Declaration assumes a god and a creation. In other contexts Shermer would criticize this document for making woo-woo claims.

In a way, you could argue that our Founding Fathers established our nation on the basis of 18th Century pseudoscience. They had to ignore the ideology when it came to making the country work practically, of course, and white identitarian considerations came to predominate over high-minded philosophical blather about equality.

SLCain
Guest
I remember reading Shermer’s Why People Believe Weird Things about twenty years ago – must have been soon after it was published. In it, he talked about all the crazy stuff he used to believe in – crystal power, the Bermuda Triangle, Ancient Aliens, etc. – and how he overcame such fallacious beliefs through the power of skepticism. Of course, his skepticism has limits. He probably would consider the notion that mean intellectual ability differs between the races to be one of those “weird things” that people just “believe”. I.e., he is not really a skeptic now, he has just… Read more »
Lucas Bullivant
Guest

What pseudoscience? Leading scientists like Benjamin Franklin were counted amongst the Founders and some of the greatest scientists ever like Euler appear to have supported the War for Independence.

Johnny Fascismo
Guest
I get why you wanted to end the article on a white pill, it being the 4th of July and all. But honestly the different white groups only really started to get along when actual non-whites were brought into the equation. Sure, we all can get along with each other and be able to put our differences aside to work for common goals and interests, but it involves certain groups abandoning their ties to the old country and embracing Anglo White Americanism as their new identity. With Europe under cultural assault, I’m more inspired to embrace my old country identity… Read more »
Vincent Law
Guest

Yeah, I think a lot of people feel the same way to be honest.

craicher
Guest
That depends on if one is American or not and I mean American in an ethnic sense that everyone in America understood 60 years ago. It is interesting that on the census Southern Whites are the only group left who self identify as American. Anyway, real Americans don’t really have a native country to look back on as America is their native land. But I understand your sentiments. I have not been back to the states for a year now and except to see family and friends, drink whiskey and eat good food (yes, there is some really good food… Read more »
Percival Ruggles
Guest

A “real American” would be an American of predominantly Anglo colonial stock.

craicher
Guest

The Irish, Scottish and Welsh are not Anglos and they outnumbered them in many places in the Old South, and neither were the Germans or Dutch. All part of the founding stock of America though they may have integrated into the dominant Anglo culture. America’s founding stock is Germano-Celtic not Anglo.

That is Abraham Lincoln war propaganda or post war propaganda. The Puritans had their foothold in New England but not in the rest of Colonial America.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

I’m sorry, but you are woefully misinformed about the ethnic character or America’s founding population. It is Anglo-Germanic and Protestant. Wales has been a part of England for about 800 years. Lowland Scotland was settled by Angles and Anglo-Normans. The “Scots-Irish” are not the same as the Celtic Irish. The Scots-Irish were Lowland Scottish people that colonized Ireland.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Now you’re adding in the Germans, I thought most of America was Anglo? Keep moving those goalposts Johnny Bull.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Yes, most of the founding stock was Anglo. However, there was a small smattering of Dutch and Germans. I’m not moving the goalposts at all.

Why are you so determined to paint the historic American nation as some sort of nightmarish ethnic amalgam?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

There’s a small smattering of Germans? Obviously you’ve never been to the Midwest!

Percival Ruggles
Guest

There was only a small smattering when the country was founded. However, they were thoroughly assimilated and Anglicized. Think of Roosevelt for instance. He was the quintessential yankee WASP. However, his surname is Dutch in origin. I never claimed America was purely 100% English at its founding, but that it was overwhelmingly Anglo in a broad sense.

craicher
Guest

Roosen Felt (textile merchant) is clearly a jewish name.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Germans are the largest White ethnicity in America. This is widely accepted. If you have proof that there are more English people then Germans, please show it, and no I’m not accepting your lame “big tent Anglo” definition where a Scotsman is Anglo.

Hereward
Guest

It is not widely accepted, you’re just lying.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

A Lowland Scot(90% of Scotland’s population) empirically is an ethnic Anglo.

http://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Lowland_Scots

Hereward
Guest

Keep on with your anti- English shit stirring you cretin. The people who founded and defined America were overwhelmingly English. Jefferson, Franklin, Washington etc.

Your fetish about 19th century German immigrants somehow being the core of America is laughable (and likely a product of a Nazi fetish)

craicher
Guest

Ok then go to the Scottish lowlands, go to a dive bar late at night when everyone has downed a few too many and tell them who they are. Please make arrangments for your funeral beforehand.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Ethnicity is determined by common ancestry, what you genetically are, not what you have been brainwashed into identifying as. Lowland Scots identifying as “Gaelic” is as absurd as all the White Americans that claim to have Cherokee ancestry. It’s a fetish for something exotic and different.

Of course I wouldn’t call a Scottish person an Englishmen as those are political differences with different histories, but the English and Lowland Scots share a common origin in the same way the the Danish and Norse do. Or the Spanish and Portuguese, etc.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Ian Paisley did not call himself English, yet here you are doing it for him.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

You can cite exceptions to me all day long. Rachel Dollezal identifies as a Negro, but that doesn’t make her one.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Because Ian Paisley is just like some cunt who fakes that she’s black. False equivalence.

craicher
Guest

I guess all those Gaelic names of villages, rivers, and the.surnames of the people themselves are brainwashing?

If there is any brainwashing going on it is that they are Anglo and it looks like you are the only one who believes it.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Edinburgh, Melrose, etc. don’t sound very Gaelic to me. You will find a smattering of Gaelic placenames throughout all of Great Britain as many localities were founded by the Britons.

Lowlanders are of Northumbrian origin. Lowland Scotland only came under control of the Dal Riada Gaelic Scots after the Battle of Carham. However, power gradually shifted to the Lowlands and the Anglian derived “Scots” came to dominate the political entity known as Scotland.

craicher
Guest

Clearly you have never been there and are talking right out your a…

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Are you from the UK?

craicher
Guest

I have lived and worked in the South of England and studied in Ireland. I have lived on three continents and write you now from the very north of Europe. Born and bred in good ole Missisipee

Hereward
Guest

Well I’m actually British and you’re wrong.

Hereward
Guest

Germany has plenty of Celtic place names still too, does that mean the Germans are Scottish? Place names persist, just look at all the Spanish names in cities and natural features in the southern United States

craicher
Guest

I like your example. The Germanic people wiped out the Celtic people/culture thousands of years ago in the nation today we know as Germany. We can all see what your sick mind is fantasizing about. Ah, but you couldn’t wipe out the Scots, Welsh and Irish. Let bygones be bygones but don’t sit around fantasizing about Germanizing the world, Whites must work together and that means good fences make good neighbors. Poland for the Poles, Scotland for the Scots, England for the English, and no place at the table for fools like you.

Hereward
Guest

Yes, because they’re poorly educated simpletons, the lowland Scots spoke a Germanic language and despised the highlanders. In dress and habits they were identical to the English (William Wallace never wore a kilt or woad)

craicher
Guest

Or because their fathers and mothers told them they were Scottish, as did theirs, as did theirs, as did theirs, back into the mists of time? The British (English) Empire is over. Get over it. The English are not a special people. You have no right to rule over and define other Whites (or try to commit genocide against them as you did against the Scots and Irish). Take your English superiority and hole up in England waiting for the muslims to turn into a caliphate and leave the rest of us Whites alone.

W. Freudenfeuer
Guest

White English people whose ancestors had lived in England for centuries had their DNA tested in the 90s – it was found to be about 80% Celtic, if my memory serves me. This makes sense if you stop to think about the actual numbers involved during the Germanic settlement of the country.

Incidentally, it is open to question whether the ‘Celts’ of Britain and Ireland are actually majority pre-Celtic in their DNA. Archaeologists have found no evidence suggesting an invasion of Britain or Ireland by the Celts.

craicher
Guest

Sykes (or something like that) of Oxford says it is pre-Celtic. Ice age hunter gatherers.

Hereward
Guest

Scots Irish were neither Irish nor particularly Scottish, they were Anglo Saxon ethnicity lowland borderers, know as “Reivers”.

Don’t act like you know what you’re talking about when you don’t.

craicher
Guest

You are in fantasy land. The Scots are who they say they are and I have never known one who called himself or herself British. Not one. Most would throw a punch if you claimed they lived in North Britain.

Are you a mongrel? These days mostly only Mongrels intentify as British.

If the Zulus say they are Zulus, if the Han Chinese say they are Han, if the Scottish say they are Scottish then that is what they are. You don’t get to define them for them. Get over yourself, step back and show some respect for people.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

By your logic, I as a White man could self identify as a Negro and I would be just as much of a Negro as an ethnic Bantu. That’s not how it works.

craicher
Guest

So the Scottish people identifying as Scottish or the Russian people identifying as Russian are the same as you as a White man identifying as a Bantu?

You are mentally ill.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

You are mentally ill if you deny basic evidence and history. It is erroneous for someone to identify as a different ethnic group is my point.

craicher
Guest

So what gives you the right to tell Scottish people who they are?

I don’t need basic evidence. The Swedes tell me they are Swedes. The Finns tell me they are Finns. The Irish tell me they are Irish. Who the f… are you to tell them who they are?

Percival Ruggles
Guest

I’m part Lowland Scottish myself and my family has always identified as Anglo-Saxon going back generations. It doesn’t matter how someone self identifies if they do so erroneously. The fact is that Lowlanders are Anglian derived. Facts are facts. Anyone is correct in realizing this. The Celtic thing is less than a century old. If you read anything about the Lowlands Scots pre-20th century you will note that they have historically been very anti-Gaelic.

They have been referred to historically as the “English in the kingdom of the Scots”.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Some reading for you to do:

http://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Lowland_Scots

http://www.scotland.com/forums/language/26886-lowland-scots-ruin-scotland.html

http://scottishdreamtours.blogspot.co.uk/2010/01/scotland-difference-between-highlanders.htmlcomment image

Also, notice how lowland surnames are overwhelmingly of English and occasionally Welsh origin (Anglo-Saxon or Anglo-Norman).

VindenVänder
Guest

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2408591/American-ethnicity-map-shows-melting-pot-ethnicities-make-USA-today.html

“By far the largest ancestral group, stretching from coast to coast across 21st century America is German, with 49,206,934 people. The peak immigration for Germans was in the mid-19th century as thousands were driven from their homes by unemployment and unrest.”

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Self identification. Add up the Anglo groups. That isn’t accurate.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Don’t even try. This guy just flat out ignores demographics. Anyone who has spent time in the Midwest acknowledges Germans as the largest White ethnic group. Milwaukee, Chicago, the Twin Cities, St. Louis, Cincinnati, these were all German cities.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

When Hispanics become the largest plurality group will you claim that they are the “true Americans”?

A country is defined by and belongs to its founding population. In any case, if you add up all the British groups plus “American”, it far overshadows the Germans. That’s the part you want to conveniently ignore.

Hereward
Guest

That’s bullshit, as was implicit in the post you replied to;

“Southern Whites are the only group left who self identify as American”

They are overwhelmingly of British stock, and like other Anglo Americans, they just identify as “American”.

People with British heritage will almost always choose any other white identity ahead of it, so people with 1 Irish Great Grand Parent will identify as “Irish American” for example.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Locke was wrong. The Founders were wrong. Natural Law has reached its logical end in America, where fresh off the boat immigrants are as American as 10th generation Whites descended from Colonial settlers.

The Alt Right rejects Locke, Kant, Hume and Enlightenment thought. The Alt Right embraces Hobbes, Machiavelli, and Schmitt. We see the world as it is, not as some idealistic notion as how it should be.

Albionic American
Guest
As I pointed out above, the Founders based the country on 18th Century pseudoscience. Which I find tragically ironic, because the Enlightenment’s philosophes said that all ideas come from experience, and that we should use experience to test new ideas. Yet our Founders conducted a reckless, radical experiment with ideas from the Enlightenment that they had no experience with to see if they would work. Two hundred forty-one years later, we have enough of a baseline to tell that many of these ideas – mainly under the headings of equality, atomized individualism, deracinated personhood, personal identity shopping and proposition nationalism… Read more »
craicher
Guest

Machiavelli, I believe, was satire,

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

So was Swift, they were both political statements to get around censorship.

craicher
Guest

I meant The Prince was meant to show how an evil tyrant would rule and was modeled on a contemporary prince in Venice. It was meant to show how not to rule.

But if we ever want power we will certainly need to be cunning and play the game.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

What Machiavelli intended did not happen, and people take “The Prince” to mean that a ruler must be hard and ruthless. Sort of like how Jews wrote “Tomorrow Belongs to Me,” only to see Richard Spencer use it as a clarion call.

https://twitter.com/RichardBSpencer/status/843216482838355968?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fvariety.com%2F2017%2Fbiz%2Fnews%2Frichard-spencer-alt-right-cabaret-twitter-jason-kander-response-1202012578%2F

Lucas Bullivant
Guest

Machiavelli intended The Prince as a way to describe what leaders often have to do to stay in power. If the leader does good things with that power, then his seemingly ruthless actions are often justifiable.

Lucas Bullivant
Guest

The Enlightenment should be divided up into multiple movements: one being French and another being British. You have the British Enlightenment all wrong. Locke didn’t so much refute Hobbes as build on his work, and Locke certainly didn’t think that Natural Rights implied necessary race-mixing and miscegenation. In fact, in order to satisfy the idealism of our Founders and colonial forbearers, we must secure the racial integrity White societies, at least until dramatic advances are made in genetic engineering and other areas. Race gives rise to culture, so Natural Law must allow for race.

Hipster Racist
Guest
“What is wrong with the Anglos working together, pursuing their own civilization, and creating a sort of unofficial Anglosphere?” Of course there is nothing wrong with that. And we have it, it’s called “Five Eyes” and it’s a cornerstone of Anglo power. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_under_Five_Eyes_surveillance No, American independence was not a mistake – we’re far better off than Britain is at this point. The Royal Family of England’s recent wedding was, as my wife put it, “a celebration of White Supremacy,” but one only needs to look at the public stances of everyone from the Queen, to Charles, to Diana, to see… Read more »
Vincent Law
Guest

Don’t recall counter-signaling the Enlightenment or promoting Monarchy, but alright.

Hipster Racist
Guest

Maybe not from you but it took exactly 20 minutes for it to start.

Anime Nazi Troll 4000
Guest
Anime Nazi Troll 4000

I appreciate the Enlightenment ideals of all men being treated equally by government, with the franchise being limited to rational, invested (property-owning), educated men.

Monarchy is an artificial construct of class status which can be helpful in organizing groups of people, but ultimately creates violence, as the allure for concentrated power becomes too strong and divides White identity against itself in the interest of some manipulator fancying himself above the rest of his folk.

There. I just countersignaled monarchy for ya. 😉

Hipster Racist
Guest
If there was an online faction of trolls LARPing about the Enlightenment or “getting back” to the Protestantism of the 1700s – I’d be against them too. It’s not fascism, the Enlightenment, monarchy, the counter-Enlightenment, or Romanticism that is the problem. The problem is the LARPing. The problem is the Cargo Cult. It’s one thing to fight against the Jews trying to co-opt American symbols, like the American flag or Lady Liberty – that’s useful and a good way to show solidarity with “the normies.” But no one is suggesting all we need is to “get back to the Constitution”… Read more »
Anime Nazi Troll 4000
Guest
Anime Nazi Troll 4000
I agree with most of what you’re saying, especially with regard to elites. Elites throughout history and even (neolithic) prehistory have (more often than not, imo) sociopathically and manipulatively looked out for their own at the EXPENSE of their folk. But I think our history provides a rallying cry for those who wish to show we had the right ideas at some point along the way. They’re an ideal to which we can strive and provide a bit of flotsam to which to cling for people awash in a sea of ideas. Our tactics must change, but the positive parts… Read more »
Albionic American
Guest
To fight the anti-whites, we will need modern weapons, technology, a form of globalism that is pro-white, and a future-oriented outlook. I’ve written about the need for a pro-white humanism, or even a pro-white transhumanism, given my cryonics activism. (I might wind up in a cryogenic dewar next to Bob Whitaker some day.) When you abandon the delusions of equality and universalist ethics, you also free yourself from guilt over the impossible task of trying to save everyone, because, frankly, we just have too many low-quality people in the world who can’t function at the modern level, no matter how… Read more »
Vincent Law
Guest
I really hate to break it to you, but there is no great WASP awakening that I see on the ground. The Anglos in the movement are all the leaders. Almost everyone else that I talk to in the rank and file at Alt-Right events is half-Italian or half-Irish, or part Polish and identifies more strongly with that identity than with their anglo side. Furthermore, very few consider themselves “American” and proudly rattle off that they are a quarter Welsh and 1/8 Austrian or something similar. This goes for regular folks as well. Spend anytime with expats from America in… Read more »
Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

WASPs voluntarily gave their own institutions of High Finance and the Ivy League over to the Jews.

Lucas Bullivant
Guest
The Jews didn’t take High Finance until Greenspan. I could write volumes about how it happened. It was also under Greenspan that Darien, CT. let large numbers of Jews move in. The real test that only Ron Unz ever has mentioned is the fate of the Ivy League now that the Jews have declined so much academically. Asians have surpassed the Jews in prominence. It’ll be interesting to see if the Asians take over the Ivy League. Right now, it’s looking like the Asians will take over prestigious non-Ivy schools like Cal-Tech and MIT, but not gain control of the… Read more »
Hipster Racist
Guest
“the rank and file at Alt-Right” The White Nationalist movement has always been bigger than Spencer’s personal brand “Alt Right” and the Southern Nationalists are still the biggest faction;. “Well, why should they want to adopt YOUR cultural legacy?” Why should I adopt theirs? The Irish have their homeland, the Italians have their homeland. The “fascist” LARPing has never achieved anything more than an online subculture and is likely to be about as successful as “punk rock” would have been without the support of mass media corporations. The vast majority of White Trump supporters have nothing to do with fascist… Read more »
Vincent Law
Guest
No, the implications are not obvious. People are resisting Americana culture in one way or another. Some are LARPing as Nazis or Fascists or unrelated to the Right. Some are LARPing as Commies or wearing their kilts or hate Americana culture so much they dip into escapism in droves through Anime and embrace a foreign culture that appeals to them more than the culture they were raised in- which is a damning critique of said culture. Furthermore, a lot of Americans don’t like/never were Protestants and don’t like the social mores and progressivism and elitism of it. They are discontent… Read more »
Hipster Racist
Guest
“you are offering more of the same” Pure projection. I’ve never asked anyone to become a Protestant. If there were obnoxious Protestant LARPers constantly telling people we have to “get back to the Reformation” – like there are fake Catholics telling us we have to “go back before the Enlightenment” – I’d “counter-signal” them too. Fortunately, the idiot “CI” Bible thumper types were driven out of the pro-white movement a decade ago. It’s telling how touchy the online trolling culture gets when one single guy points out that it’s all just LARPing, not anything of substance. Generation Snowflake apparently includes… Read more »
Johnny Fascismo
Guest

comment image

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

“Real fascism was a movement of its time and place.”

Early 20th Century WASP Nativism was a movement of its time and place. The vast majority of White Trump supporters have nothing to do with WASP Gentleman’s Club LARPing.

Vincent Law
Guest

Next I’ll hear how Maine or New Hampshire style Conservatism is the only real American way of doing right-wing politics.

I wouldn’t even mind so much if it weren’t blatantly obvious who our base of support was in the states and how they are almost all NOT mayflower descendents.

You can point to the South though. But then those Bad Whites got destroyed by the Good White Puritans from up North, didn’t they?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Yes, let’s LARP with New England style WASP town halls.

Most rich WASPs= Jeb Bush.

Trump is like most White Americans, he’s mixed European descent, half German and half Scot.

Vincent Law
Guest

He should have married a Daughter of the American Revolution member to be a real American conservative.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Trump’s preference for traditional Central European women who are good mothers offends my WASP sensibilities. We need a good WASP first lady like Barbara Bush who is comfortable speaking out in favor of abortion.

W. Freudenfeuer
Guest

It’s kind of obvious why Trump prefers women from there. Most of them stand out a mile here in Britain. Most native British people can spot a Continental here on sight.

Albionic American
Guest

But the Germans and the Scots both have a tradition of valuing the United States as a second home and a refuge from the Old World. (A few Scots even signed the Declaration of Independence.) They show proprietary interest in maintaining this country’s value, unlike the Jews who treat this country as a throwaway because they keep Israel as their bugout destination.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Of course, and notice that the German-Scot Trump has actual real businesses like hotels and golf courses that employ people and provide good jobs. Not Jewish hedge funds and stock speculation.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Most White Americans are of Anglo derivation. The following groups are Anglo:

– “American”
– English
– Scottish
– Welsh
– Scots-Irish

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

More bullshit. The two largest White ethnicities in America are German and Irish.

Also, the Scots Irish are Anglo?!?! They were certainly never thought of as such back in the day.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Lol ok. Add up the groups I listed according to the census and get back to me.

Also, self identification is unreliable in a country that fetishizes exotic admixture. Being 1/8 German and 7/8 Anglo does not make you “German”. Also, many of the “Irish” larpers are actually of Scots-Irish Presbyterian origin.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Many of the “Americans” in Appalachia are the “mongrels” you deride with German, Irish, Italian admixture. It’s apparent you have a problem with the fact that WASP leaders in the 20th century were flaccid Cucks who handed off their birthright to Jews, but most White Americans are not of “Anglo” descent.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Yes, “Scots-Irish” is a geographic designation, not an ethnic one. The Scots-Irish are Lowland Scottish people and northern English that colonized northern Ireland.

Lowland Scots: http://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Lowland_Scots

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

You’re inventing terminology to suit your world view. No one in colonial or early America thought of Scots-Irish frontier settlers like Andrew Jackson as “Anglo.”

Percival Ruggles
Guest

No, I’m not inventing anything. You just want to marginalize the Anglo-American founding stock. The colonists certainly viewed the Scots-Irish as Anglo. Now, they were viewed as less refined, but there was always a common ethnic foundation. Look up what Andrew Jackson said about his Ulster blood.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Yeah, you’re triggered over the obvious links of Puritan WASP culture leading to the vacuous Civic Nationalism of today’s America. This has been thought over and discussed for a long time by thinkers like de Benoist and MacDonald who are smarter than you.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

The Puritan thing is way overplayed. Gee, I wonder if *McDonald* and *Benoist* might hold a grudge against native Americans. The Jews are the issue and always have been.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

It’s damn Catholick resentment and not serious Academic inquiry!

craicher
Guest

Haha. Tell an Irishman or a Scot that he is an Anglo and you better have your fists up.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

An Celtic Catholic Irishman from the Republic is definitely not an Anglo. Neither is a Celtic Highland Scot. However, Lowland Scots and Ulsterman(Scots-Irish) are of Anglo origin: http://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Lowland_Scots

90% of “Scottish” people are Lowlanders. The “Scots-Irish” are Lowland Scots/Northern English Protestants that colonized Ulster provincr in Ireland during the Plantation. Neither group is Celtic or Catholic.

craicher
Guest

Let’s ask them. And I already know the answer. Sorry, but you ain’t allowed to identify them for them. They are who they say they are not you.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Ok, ask a Scottish Lowlander if they identify as a Gaelic Highlander Catholic.

craicher
Guest

Outside of New England very few White Americans have any Mayflower (ish) ancestors even if they like to fantasize about it.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

But many White Americans are the descendants of a Cherokee Princess!

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Let’s ignore the entire South?

craicher
Guest

The South is minority Anglo but majority Celtic.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

No it’s not. That’s disinformation. The South is overwhelmingly Anglo-Saxon in origin.

Why do you think it is Celtic?

craicher
Guest

Well if you aren’t from there and you don’t know then you can look it up. Cracker Culture: Celtic Ways in the Old South is a good book. Albions Seed another. I am from there and have lived in England (Anglos) and Ireland and many other countries. I can tell you without a doubt that the South is eons closer to Ireland than England in not just the look of the people but the language, food, drinking culture…the folkways of the people. There is no doubt

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

The South was cleared and settled by Scots Irish frontiersmen. And no, the Scots Irish aren’t Anglo! Even Ian Paisley considered himself British but also Irish because he was born in and lived in Ireland.

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/ian-paisley-i-d-never-deny-i-m-irish-1-6307792

Percival Ruggles
Guest

If you had read Albion’s Seed, you wouldn’t have come to that conclusion.

When you say “Ireland” do you mean the Republic of Ireland or Northern Ireland? I am from the South. Born and raised.

craicher
Guest

Wolf Tone, the founder of the United Irishmen was a protestant.

craicher
Guest

Tidewater Gentry were English and a minority. The rest were Irish, Scottish and Welsh.

Very funny because I have used Fisher in my classes. Hahahaha.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

I still believe you are lumping the Scots-Irish into the “Irish” category. Wales was and still is formally incorporated into England. The Scots were the Lowlanders I have been talking about. They are all a part of the same broad British group.

craicher
Guest

Clearly you have never met any Welshmen either. Seems your mind is stuck with the colonial mindset of the English. Please leave it in England. We don’t need it in America not to mention Ireland, Scotland and Wales.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Tell me again about how George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin, and the rest of the Anglo-Saxon founders were really Celts.

craicher
Guest

Just as I alluded to the elites of the time were of English origin. This is getting meaningless. You are not open to the truth, to reality but want to live in some fantasy America of glorious Englishmen that never existed. Besides if you ever lived in England as I have then you would aee they are not exactly something to aspire to.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

I think we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

craicher
Guest

Agreed

craicher
Guest

Then open up a phone book and start reading the names. Unless you are in a coastal area?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Many coastal English Southerners are effete faggots like Lindsey Graham.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

Don’t see many Mc’s. Taylor, Smith, Jones, ……..

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Jones is not an English name….

Percival Ruggles
Guest

It’s Welsh, I know.

Hipster Racist
Guest

Thankfully, I’m not suggesting “going back” to the WASP nativism of the 1920s .

Percival Ruggles
Guest

The majority of White Trump supporters were from Anglo derived groups. You are giving the mongrels too much credit.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Yeah, I call bullshit. The majority of white Trump supporters were not “Anglos.”

Vincent Law
Guest

Funny enough, a guy with the handle “Anime Nazi Troll” upvoted your comment. Will that be enough to open your eyes to the de facto reality of the Alt-Right?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

We need more people overtaking Social clubs like the Elks or even the hoi polloi Knights of Columbus and we need less Anime Nazi Trolls.

Anime Nazi Troll 4000
Guest
Anime Nazi Troll 4000

It’s more an avatar used ironically, but I get your implication. 😉

I sympathize with the fascists in certain respects, but liked his comment because I liked part of it – am fairly generous with my upvotes if I see some part of a comment that I like.

I think if the South had won, we’d likely see a more idealized republic holding true to some of the core beliefs among the Alt-Right.

Hipster Racist
Guest
I understand the de facto reality of the currently existing Alt-Right – I hope to drag those Anime Nazi Trolls out of their mom’s basements and into the larger White society. I hope everyone realizes that the 4chan culture has peaked – it’s nearly TWENTY years old – and it’s great victory, the Meme Wars of the last election – is over. It worked to destabilize the youngest employees of legacy media companies. But the media corporations have already figured it out, they have ALREADY successfully begun to co-opt that culture. Generals always fight the last battle. For all the… Read more »
Anime Nazi Troll 4000
Guest
Anime Nazi Troll 4000

You’d be surprised at what you can do with a cell phone and two thumbs.

Say something enough in the right places and you’ll have thought leaders regurgitating your material on a mass scale.

Hipster Racist
Guest

Hey I had Richard Spencer adopting my memes nearly five years ago – AND giving me credit for it.

I usually get push back before people admit that’s I’m right, that’s usually how it works.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

They should adopt our cultural legacy because their ancestors chose to come to our country which was founded by WASPs. What if Americans started migrating to Italy en masse and promoted American culture at the expense of the native Italians. Would that be ok?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Your cultural legacy like Harvard, Yale, and Wall St which were handed off to Jews?

Percival Ruggles
Guest

So? Because WASPs were subverted their entire cultural legacy should be utterly destroyed and we should join in with the deracinated mongrel masses? Why do you hate the people that founded the country? You don’t have to stay here you know.

Every White country has been subverted by Jewry in one way or another. However, the United States has been subverted to the extent it has because of its success. Jews flock to where the money is.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

WASPs subverted themselves, as Kevin MacDonald has said. You can’t blame all your problems on other people. The logical end point of New England WASP Protestant Calvinism is the America you see today.

Johnny Fascismo
Guest

WASP = White Acting Semetic Puppets

Vincent Law
Guest

You were complicit in it. Even now, you marry your kids off to the Jews. They get the in to the country club and the WASPs get their money. A match made in heaven…the AngloZionist merger.

Percival Ruggles
Guest

The problem is that you are confusing elite Yankee WASPs with all WASPs.

Vincent Law
Guest

I specifically mentioned southerners as being an exception.

Crud Bonemeal
Guest
The WASPs destroyed their own cultural legacy. And did a lot of damage to the world in the process. We’re trying to rebuild something out of the post-apocalyptic wasteland that was created when the WASPs handed over power to the Jews. Nobody is going to hand power back to the WASPs out of a sense of moral obligation; their representation in the future is going to proportional to the amount of work that they do to rebuild it. Right now, I do not see a lot of interest in WASP stuff outside of the South. I don’t even really know… Read more »
Johnny Fascismo
Guest

Italy has been getting flooded with the refugees of American foreign policy for decades. The only Americans who should be welcome are those with Italian blood. Personally I’m all for the “diaspora” Europeans remigrating back to their motherlands and leaving the Anglos and Jews with the mess they have created.

altright_sobriquet
Guest
I never understood my WASP family’s ignorance concerning racial and Jewish questions. A dislike / distrust of Blacks and Jews was implicit, but they missed what was taking place perhaps because of the upheaval with Vietnam and the 1960’s counterculture. I would not underestimate the power of the mass media in the 60’s and 70’s – then TV and print. If you look back at the media from the era the shift was subtle, gradual, and couched in moral undertones. Assisted by Catholics, it wasn’t until the the late 70’s and 80’s with the likes of Sandy Weill, Kissinger, and… Read more »