Perspective

Why We Get Healthcare Totally Wrong

Part I of II

It’s baaack. . . In March, Trump’s proposed “American Healthcare Act” was so unpopular it wasn’t even put up for a vote. The episode was so embarrassing that most pundits (including me) thought Trump wouldn’t touch the issue again until 2019 at the earliest.

But the AHCA has returned, and this time, it’s somehow worse.

Trump himself doesn’t seem to understand what’s in the bill. We can only assume that he’s racing to pass something—anything!—so he can claim a small victory and sate Conservatism, Inc.’s seven-year obsession with “repelling Obamacare.”

To get the “Freedom Caucus” on board, the bill now has less coverage than it did last March. In order to appeal to the “moderates” in the GOP, the bill maintains the basic structure of Obamacare.

This is one of those “compromises” that is the worst of both worlds. As Ann Coulter recently tweeted:

The Republicans’ clueless messaging and total lack of imagination in policy-making has likely bolstered Obamacare’s popularity, which has retraced its highest levels of support. Voters grasp that Republicans want to change the system, but don’t understand what will be put in its place. In a climate of uncertainty, people tend to cling to what they’ve got. The stark reality is that Obamacare is more popular than Trump. One can only wonder why Republicans are so eager to die on the AHCA hill, especially when other, more winnable battles could be fought.

Ultimately, the problems with AHCA and Obamacare are not fixable, because they are fundamental and conceptual. The solution is not some cute new incentive or state subsidy; it is a new paradigm.

Let’s start with what is wrong.

Insurance Is The Problem, Not The Solution

Everyone seems to assume that we need more “affordable health insurance.” The debate is over how to get it: more government subsidies or a free market. But this is the wrong place to start. First off, what we call “health insurance” is not truly insurance at all, nor is producing more of it going to lead to better care. We need less health insurance, not more.

Essential to the concept of insurance is that no one expects to use it. For the holder, insurance is a hedge against unforeseen, rare, and catastrophic outcomes. For the lender, insurance is a gamble that the holder won’t call in the liability.[1]

Today, what we call “health insurance” is better understood as pre-payments or installment programs. Everyone expects to use their “insurance” regularly every year, for both unpredictable illnesses and totally predictable checkups. Both AHCA and Obamacare seek to lower these installment payments by creating mandates and incentives that pool the healthy and the sick, the young and old, as a way of averaging out costs.

So the real question is this: Why are we attempting to provide healthcare by socializing the insurance market? Why is this the paradigm? And why do we keep doing it, when the result is that the U.S. spends more on healthcare than any other nation, including the “socialist” ones.

The deeper answer to these questions probably lies in the American psyche. “Socialized medicine” is for those wimpy Europeans and Canadians and the working poor. America doesn’t have a proletariat, or rather it has one that thinks of itself as “middle class.” Thus, Americans like talking about “muh health insurance,” a product for rich people, as opposed to talking about the government simply providing care for people who can’t afford it. A similar situation occurs in the “food stamp” program. Americans are provided with EBT cards (electronic benefit transfer) that act like fancy credit cards. As opposed to simply providing basic foodstuffs for the poor (yes, literally government cheese) along with exercise regiments, the government lets Americans pretend they are wealthy consumers out shopping. The result is that poor aren’t starving . . . they’re obese. Similarly, America’s “free-market healthcare” involves more government spending than a socialist one.

Insurance Prices Are Not Driven By Supply And Demand

American healthcare is screwed up precisely because it operates through insurance markets.

The typical conservative solution to the overpriced insurance market is “more competition.” But insurance—and especially health insurance—is not like other goods in a free market and does not respond to competition.

With a typical demand curve for any product, as the price rises, demand falls. For example, while many men would be willing to spend $1,000 for a new suit, few would be willing to buy a suit priced at $20,000; and effectively none would purchase a suit for $1 million.

Healthcare is different because it is not simply about desire for a luxury, which could be satisfied or abandoned, depending on price. Demand for healthcare derives from the most basic instinct for life. Healthcare is existential. And we will mortgage our future to cling to life. Indeed, near the end, we will spend tremendous amounts just to keep our hearts beating, especially since we know debts will be liquidated in death.

Moreover, while a new suit’s price is on the tag, when we visit a hospital, we have no idea what the ultimate cost of our care will be. In such a scenario, the most basic pricing function is simply inoperative.

Again, insurance is not like others products or services. Insurance is a gamble on the part of the lender and borrower. It is thus determined algorithmically and actuarily. In a casino, it doesn’t matter how many people want to play Blackjack, or how many tables there are in the room; the odds are always the same.

With Obamacare and the AHCA, the “demand” for insurance is infinite, because every citizen is forced into the market, through the individual mandate or tax incentives. The “supply” is also infinite, since new insurance can be generated by the stroke of a pen; that is, there is effectively no marginal cost. The price of insurance is determined by actuarial calculation: how can the firm profit knowing how many people will die, how many will get sick, and how many will stay healthy in a given year. “More competition”—the brain-dead conservative answer to everything—is irrelevant, for again, the price is not determined by supply and demand.

If Trump and the Republican Congress pass the AHCA today, they can pat themselves on the back for, at last, “repealing Obamacare.” The catch is, Republicans will then take ownership of a profoundly screwed-up system, based on false premises and calculations, and one which will inevitably generate higher prices and greater unhappiness. The American Health Care Act is not “Making America Great Again,” and it does not represent a fresh start after the swamp has been drained. It is simply more of the same.

What is needed is not reform, but a totally new paradigm. And that is what I will outline in Part II of this essay.


Footnotes

  1. The classic insurance scenario, which dates back to the age of Hammurabi, is when merchants took out loans contingent on a vessel’s safe return from a voyage; if the ship sank at sea, the loan would not have to be repaid. ↩︎

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147 Comments on "Why We Get Healthcare Totally Wrong"

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FrAG
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The main problem is over-servicing and diminishing returns.

Every boomer now wants elective procedures done that their parents could not have even conceived of.

Furthermore -every boomer thinks it’s their right to consume $100-200K of critical-care costs in the last 6 months of their lives.

There is an entire industry dedicated to keeping alive the “ancient-crumbly”.

eugenedempsey@o2online.de
Guest
The last contributor is correct to point to the “conspiratorial nature” of our health care systems. Many in the medical profession recognize that there are many cases where we would be better off if we allowed the human body/human soul to try and heal itself. In the event that no such healing occurs, then we would accept with the help of grace that death is merely a continuation of the natural process of life. It is relatively easy to attack the morbid industrialization of our health care systems; much harder to articulate the consequences of challenging the principles and values… Read more »
787878781
Guest
Health care will fail because pharma/insurance/FDA/CDC/WHO designs it so. They want us to be sick and ensure we get at sick as possible with vaccines, processed GMOs, anti depressants, chem-trails, fluoridated water, and an endless media collusion of propaganda feeding us false and fake health information. In particular scaring us of non-existent diseases such as Zika. Add the fake climate change discussion…. has anyone ever bothered to ask how come CO2 was been vilified, when without CO2 we die… ? CO2 is LIFE, it fuels the entire ecosystem. Without CO2 no plant, tree or food will grow. Every plant, animal… Read more »
eugenedempsey@o2online.de
Guest
Using liberal democratic principles will never solve Health Care. Mr. Spencer is right when he calls for a new paradigm. He is also right when he questions the craziness of using the concept of insurance to provide better health care. The “Left” are onto something with their Single Payer concept; although the criterion that they would use for doling out health care services would be very different from the “Right”. For the liberal Left, providing Health Care is communism by stealth, with no distinction being made between those who deserve health care and those who don’t. That requires some tough… Read more »
bi66-ER
Guest

Make a video I can’t read…

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

So how long until GoFundMe is the United States leading health care provider?

grumpiertrucker
Guest

Looks like my original post was deleted. Disappointing that the Alt-Right would censor, especially in light of the ongoing Twitter Holocaust.
Hopefully it’s a technical glitch.
(Edit: Disregard. My bad. It’s still there.)

Telemachus_1
Guest

Repelling Obamacare? Huh?

Sam Cru
Guest

I pay $600 per year for $900,000 inpatient health insurance with no deductible. I don’t live in America. Neither the gov nor my employer subsidizes my health insurance.

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

When you consider how seriously the common white man takes medical matters, not to mention the great care that common white men customarily show for each other, you can’t help concluding this will be worked out eventually. http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/fraternity-18-members-charged-in-penn-state-students-death/ar-BBALfUC?ocid=spartanntp (“Fraternity, 18 members charged in Penn State student’s death”)

grumpiertrucker
Guest
More genius. Quick! Name me the last Government program that helped white people. Anyone? Bueller? “GI Bill.” You don’t say? World War II. And implemented when we were a 90% white country. By white people. How do you suppose Single Payer will be implemented today? The same way every other Government program is implemented: If you’re white and male, you don’t get. Everyone else: you get. And who works for the Government, that would be implementing this splendid Single Payer? It’s not white men, if my License Branch, City Hall, County Offices, Polling Stations and Airport are any indicator. And… Read more »
craicher
Guest

All nations have government. Get over it. We just need it to work for us and not against us. recapturing our governments should be our primary concern not destroying them for some jewed up ideal.

grumpiertrucker
Guest
So you struggle with reading comprehension. Typical. Nowhere did I state or even imply that nations shouldn’t have Governments. But I’ll play your game, Name the last Government program that was designed and implemented to help whites? And the free market is not some “Jewed up ideal.” Our most prosperous years were immediately following World War 2, when Jews had just arrived here after fleeing Europe. They didn’t have a foothold here at that point like they do now. The biggest companies were run by Gentiles… Rockefellers, Kennedy’s, Fords, Hughes. Not Jewish names. Actually, it’s the Jewed up ideal that’s… Read more »
craicher
Guest
I am not reading your entire….yawn. I hope you are very young because you make many false claims at the beginning of your spiel. One that Jews arrived here after WWII. Two, immediately after WWII the West was mostly unionized workers who were treated well. It was by no means a time of “free market” insanity. on the contrary the USA and other Western nations enjoyed a time of greater equality between the classes than ever. Working in a slaughter house was a good job that fathers passed to their sons. Just for an example. Now in the free market… Read more »
grumpiertrucker
Guest
Ha! So you brag repeatedly about not even reading what you’re responding to… classic. I never meant to imply that there were no Jews here until after World War 2. I thought about that when I wrote it because I know you people aren’t very smart.. but I took a chance and hoped you’d understand the point. But you didn’t. Yeah, Jews have always been here. But they didn’t control everything like they do now until they started migrating here in great numbers during and after the War. Look up any old pictures of civic leaders. Look up the studio… Read more »
craicher
Guest

We people are not smart? I smell a yid.

You are a hostile racial alien. That is clear. You spew out lies. Hollywood was mudblood from its inception.

craicher
Guest

Too long to read but from the first phrase, many whites get food stamps, obamacare, and so on. When I was a kid, we went to get our vaccinations at the free clinic and were the only Whites there. My brother and I played a game, push each other into fat Black women.

Not that i support these welfare programs in an ideal world. But yea, we don’t live in a an ideal world.

grumpiertrucker
Guest

I said, “helps.” I didn’t say, “uses.” Your premise is flawed. You are asserting that food stamps and Obamacare help people. They do not. They trap them. You seem to be admitting this in your next sentence when you say, “Not that I support these…” Why don’t you support them? You just said they help people.
But step back from even that… Is society as a whole… blacks and whites…better off now with these massive welfare programs? No. By every metric.

craicher
Guest
You have some points but still every civilized nation has a decent system of comprehensive healthcare coverage and the “free market” nonsense will only line the pockets of the well heeled and do nothing of good for our people. I mentioned Obamacare and food stamps to point out that it is not only dindus who get them. If I were Emperor I would do away with all welfare and have workfare for a short while in a transition phase back to self sufficiency. But like I said we are not in an ideal world and have to play the hand… Read more »
grumpiertrucker
Guest
So you’re repeating Daily Kos talking points, too. Every other civilized nation doesn’t have decent comprehensive coverage. That’s a total myth perpetuated by the same Jews who want single payer. If you look at our cancer survival rates as well as other diseases we absolutely crush any country on Earth. You’re falling for the lie that lifespan somehow is affected by quality of healthcare. Japan ranks higher in lifespan than we do because they are a homogeneous culture that doesn’t drive, doesn’t have guns, doesn’t drink and smoke or do narcs nearly as much as we do. We have a… Read more »
craicher
Guest

Wut? The japs smoke like chimneys and drive cars and drink. And you make all kinds of other false claims. In any case Spencer is right (Right) and our people need the security and comfort of knowing that if they get sick or need help it is there.

Up with the Whites!

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

You are correct.

Jon-David
Guest

Dude, hands down best observation. L

Fred
Guest

Do not have an opinion on this cuck item in Trump’s agenda, but seems like the whole Right wing, Coulter, Cerno and now Alt-Right seem to hate this passage of the AHCA through the House. We just need to realize that at some point, with ongoing demographic trends, nothing is going to work in America.

On a positive note, maybe a confidence booster for Trump to go after real items such as the Border Wall.

craicher
Guest

The insurance business is a sham created and run by the same people who brought us the joys of usury. Another way to fleece the goyim. That being said, collectively owned not for profit insurance schemes like they used to have in Sweden with insurers like Folksam work very well. You pool your money for future use but the shyster at the top doing everything he can to steal the pooled money is removed.

Co-op health insurance is certainly something we should look into. And cooperatives in many other things too.

WR_the_realist
Guest

It is true that in modern health care you have no idea what the bill will be when you enter a hospital. So maybe the first step in health care reform is to require that hospitals and doctors start providing you with that information up front. The biggest threat to American health is not the cost of health insurance but the wretched poor diet of most Americans. If we promise free health care to people and tell them they can go ahead and get 100 lbs overweight, you have a formula for bankrupting the country.

Rick
Guest

One problem is there is no way that the hospital can predict the costs – one person will walk in with heart attack symptoms and just need antacids, another will need a triple bypass. This why healthcare can’t be treated like other industries, say a construction company or IT company that provide you a quote upfront. Its often not practical for patients to shop around, eg imagine someone with stroke symptoms shopping around for a hospital. I agree 100% about the diet issue.

craicher
Guest

In many scenarios they cannot give that information up front. One things leads to another and a persons health and responses to treatment are not predictable. So that is off the table.

How can every nation besides the mentally retarded ones provide health care systems that work at least on the basic level but the USA cannot? Unfathomable.

Not that it is perfect anywhere. In Europe it is said that France has the best health care system. The USA should be looking at how they do it there. Germany seems to do well too.

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

Every item of exchange is like every other item of exchange. There is nothing unique about medical insurance.

Afterthought
Guest

Not the first time Spencer is totally out of his depth, nor the last.

What is achievable in all white societies is death in multiracial America.

Next Richard will be touting public school as the answer to our education woes!

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

There’s nothing wrong with the idea of public schools or public health care. Its all a matter of who controls government institutions.

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

There is certainly something wrong with the idea of government-run schools and government-run medical care. They indirectly make someone responsible for the education or medical care of another person or another person’s children. No person should be made responsible for any such thing.

Rick
Guest
This point of view becomes appealing in countries where you have little or nothing in common with the people around you, and are basically parts of different groups in hostile competition for the same resources (in other words, America). But IMO, it makes less sense in places where one does have positive ties to those around them, because caring for the children would help the society as a whole. The later is often not the case in America, but people tend to talk about it in abstract, ideological and moral terms rather than discussing the realities of ethnic and racial… Read more »
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

You’ve stated things exactly backwards. In a place where one has regard for those around him, one does not bring a child into the world and expect others to take up the burden of rearing him or her.

craicher
Guest

Your radical individualism does not belong on the Right. You can try Libertardism with your poison.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Go to a white public school in North Dakota or Western Pennsylvania. The problem in those schools is leftist indoctrination, but otherwise the kids get a good education.

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

I didn’t say anything either way about the education’s quality, which has nothing to do with my point.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Your point was some Libertarian “muh personal responsibility” nonsense. White public schools work.

craicher
Guest
Bullshit. Public schools can be the best. And many are. If Blacks have their public schools and all they learn about is Shaka Khan well that is their problem. What we need is our own space and our own school and they will be the world’s best. The same in health care. Let the Blacks and muds take care of their own. We will do well with our own public institutions. The USA had some of the most educated students in the world when near everyone went to a public school. How about Russia, France, Germany? Where do you think… Read more »
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

In the first place, this is the last time I will be responding to you, since I don’t engage with persons who say “Bullshit” in an online exchange like this, you low-grade nothing. As to your comment’s substance, I didn’t say anything either way about the public schools’ quality, which has nothing to do with my point.

craicher
Guest

I get your point. you are a libertard. Our movement is for our people not some abstract individualism.

Teutonic Butts
Guest

Well it passed the House. Only hope now is that the Senate kills it.
I guess its back to accelerationism. Best to forget about the uni-party and just hope they crash this thing with a few survivors.

Mike M
Guest

The issue is the rising cost of medical care and drugs. Insurance is not the same thing as medical care.

Think of car parts…If a car windshield keeps increasing in costs, you don’t solve it by attacking the insurance industry…for increasing their deductible for windshield replacement..you address why windows cost so much.

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

Yes–and in this case, of medical care, the costs are going up because there really is no private exchange. The doctors, hospitals, and insurance companies are mere proxies, intended to preserve an appearance of private enterprise in what is a government system. It’s socialism American-style.

Jaggers
Guest

Healthcare is not exactly “supply and demand”, but I would say the principle still does definitely apply. It’s very simple: if an individual has a choice between different companies offering different plans for different prices, by definition you have a marketplace and free market principles. Of course it’s not easy to shop around for insurance because it’s so complicated. Obamacare forces young healthy men to subsidize women, older, sicker people, and of course poor people, especially brown people. AHCA mitigates this situation.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

There’s no such thing as a free market. There hasn’t been a free market since human beings were hunter-gatherers. It’s a unicorn.

Secondly, what do health insurers actually do? All the do is maximize profits for shareholders, impose negative externalities on society, line there pockets, and drive up costs. They don’t provide care. This is an industry that exits solely through lobbying efforts.

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

Medical insurance isn’t intended to provide care. It’s insurance. It no longer exists in the United States. What is called medical insurance or is widely-imagined to be medical insurance is government medical care, in which doctors, hospitals, and insurers are mere proxies, intended to preserve an appearance of private exchange, whether for medical care itself or medical insurance. Medical insurance is a legitimate item of exchange, as legitimate as any other type of insurance or any other good or service whatsoever. In fact, it was an excellent item of exchange, which has been destroyed.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Health insurance companies are the definition of rent seeking.

craicher
Guest

How can a product exist that you buy and that the seller does everything they legally can not to deliver? That is health insurance on the free market. It should be nationalized or made into not for profit cooperatives. Poor Lev Rubenstein may have to sell his mansion in Miami and move back to his place in Manhattan. Poor boy.

Nice to see someone bring rent seeking into the picture. That is a term most Americans will not be familiar with.

J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia
Guest
J_Bonaccorsi_Philadelphia

No–health insurance on the free market is not a product “that you buy and that the seller does everything they legally can not to deliver.” That is the pseudo-health-insurance that now exists in America and that is a government system, in which the doctors, hospitals, and insurers are mere proxies, intended to preserve an appearance of private exchange.

craicher
Guest

Right, once it is a ”true” free market and the insurer can jew you at will it will work perfectly.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

I think your “free market” remedies will find a better reception on the Ron Paul forums. Anyways a free market solution in health care is impossible because the insurance companies always engage in rent seeking to capture government regulatory agencies and enrich themselves.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

It’s the textbook definition of rent seeking. I doubt the average cuckservative has the desire or inclination to study public choice theory. It’s all about document worship (muh Constitution) and muh free markets.

These people are actually worse than the Left when you think about it.

Krafty Wurker
Guest

This debate has little or nothing to do with healthcare, and everything to do with insurance corporation profits. Remember, at least 1/7 the of the US economy is tied up in ObamaCare/TrumpCare. How would you like to have trillions of dollars running through your bank account every year.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

In the words of John Maynard Keynes: Euthanize the rentiers.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

That’s the point, there’d be no issue subsidizing the old and the poor if most people who needed Obamacare were white.

Catiline_Conspirator
Guest

“The deeper answer to these questions probably lies in the American
psyche. “Socialized medicine” is for those wimpy Europeans and Canadians
and the working poor.”

Very insightful. Unfortunately this mentality runs deep within the Alt-Right as well.

Vincent Law
Guest

Libertarianism rots the brain. Don’t try it even once, kids.

Catiline_Conspirator
Guest

Undoubtedly. But it is much deeper and more extensive than Libertarianism.

Ike35
Guest

What also runs deep in our psyche is not wanting to pay for Sha Nee Nee’s diabetes medication and going to the ER when she loses a dildo up her gash.

Marathon-Youth
Guest
What I do not like about Obamacare: some of the long list of pre existing conditions covered by Obama care -Anxiety -Heartburn -Eating disorder -Mental health disorder the list is long and Anxiety to how one eats is part of life. I mean Heartburn as a preexisting condition? is that what my taxes go? Another asinine Obamacare policy: -Freddie Mac and Fanny Mae profits are diverted to pay Obamacare. that is downright ugly. Why should the profits of massive home financing companies help pay Obamacare? -anther horror? the Affordable Health Care is extremely Unaffordable!! Yes few can afford Obamacare Premiums.… Read more »
unpaidpundit
Guest

Well, actually, untreated chronic heartburn can lead to esophogeal cancer.

Marathon-Youth
Guest

When I get acid reflux I immediately treat the symptom,
If I have a nagging case of acid reflux regardless of over the counter meds I seek a doctor. the entire process should be covered by any insurance.

Mike
Guest

You’re great on identity issues but you should probably leave the economic stuff alone.

Aetius
Guest

Every day is a new blackpill with Trump and GOP. This was not what I was looking forward to.

unpaidpundit
Guest
Single payer might be the right answer, but it is such a heavy lift, both politically and culturally, that I don’t see how it can happen at this time. Healthcare in America will have to get much worse before the general public is willing to buy into a revolutionary (for Americans) change. And things might get significantly worse for many people, even if you have employer-sponsored health insurance. The health plan that passed the House allows employers to have a life-time limit on care. I work for a megacorporation, and we had one of those limits before Obamacare. Healthcare is… Read more »
Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Get rid of for profit insurance companies. Keep the insurance companies, but make them non-profits. That’s what they do in Germany.

craicher
Guest

Are you sure those German insurance giants are non-profit? They used to be in Sweden but no more. They were founded by worker cooperatives but eventually those who could stole everything that wasn’t nailed to the floor. Makes my stomach turn.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

The German companies were non-profits when I was there a decade ago.

craicher
Guest

They were in Sweden too. i think that has all changed. I know it has in Sweden where neo-liberal economic looting has hollowed out a once proud nation. School vouchers, privatized railroad and postal service, public spaces (like city parking spaces), toll bridges (oresund to Copenhagen), defacto privatized police service by reducing them and forcing private security and on and on and on.

But hey they likes there trans, nigs, gooks and spooks. Powa to da peoples.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

That works. Or just enroll everyone on Medicare. It’s rugged, tested and works, even with the neoliberal privatization and crapification efforts.

Ris_Eruwaedhiel
Guest

Medicare is running in the red and has been since 2008. At the rate it’s going, it’ll go bust in 2028.

http://www.modernhealthcare.com/article/20160622/NEWS/160629973

The only way the US government can pay its bills is through creation of fiat currency. There isn’t enough money in the US to pay the bills the various levels of government owes.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest
The “creation of fiat currency” is how a floating, non-fixed exchange rate currency operates. In other words, the federal government spends (creates dollars) first, then taxes back a portion of what it spends. Fiscal policy = $$$$ credits to non-government; Taxes = $$$$ debits to the government sector. Taxes for revenue at the federal level are obsolete for “revenue”. Spending and taxation are independent of each other. The monetary system isn’t a recycling plant. The US government is the monopoly issuer of the dollar, which means it can’t go broke. It sets the price and quantity like a traditional monopolist.… Read more »
Telemachus_1
Guest

Very good stuff Rocco. You have no idea how happy it makes me to read this.

Telemachus_1
Guest

The United States of America never “runs in the red”. It is the most powerful nation in the history of mankind and can never run out of United States Dollars, the legal tender only it has the sovereign right to create and regulate.

There is nothing more destructive to the Alternative Right than libertarianism. Truly, there isn’t enough money? Where on earth do you think money comes from?

Rocco Manzardo
Guest
I find this Austrian School, libertarian nonsense borderline nauseating. I totally agree. The only Austrian economist that matters was the founder of the school: Carl Menger. He developed marginal utility. Rothbard and von Mises were intellectual jokes and terrible political economists. I don’t even think Rothbard understood basic macroeconomics. Lastly, you make a good point: capital costs for the federal government are ZERO. The only constraint is inflation. However, unless the economy is a full capacity (full employment), I don’t see a problem. Even at full employment taxation can be used to regulate aggregate demand. The only constraints, in the… Read more »
Telemachus_1
Guest
It is important to note that the constraint of real resources is WHY the fiction of hyperinflation is propagandized so much. Once you delude the masses into believing political economy doesn’t exist, then the relationship between sovereign currency value and the political power of the issuing sovereignty is obviated. Every libertardian mentions Weimar and Zimbabwe, but how many realize that both were and are effectively not sovereign? Weimar, obviously, was the product of a military occupation. Zimbabwe, for a variety of reasons – some of which do originate with Anglo American imperialism – does not effectively exercise sovereignty over most… Read more »
Rocco Manzardo
Guest
Also: #1 Weimar had its debts denominated in Sterling #2 Weimar’s industrial capacity was destroyed by the war, which means any and all industrial capacity was rendered useless #3 As a result of 1 and 2, it’s OUTPUT was basically controlled by other countries #4 The more they “printed”, it wasn’t being offset by real goods and services, which is what resulted in hyperinflation. Lastly, there’s more involved in the causes of hyperinflation than the quantity theory of money.. There’s a political component. They were at fifty percent deficits from spending on a fixed exhange rate to pay war reparations.… Read more »
Catiline_Conspirator
Guest

Any minute now Hipster Racist is going to show up and call you a “Nazi Larper.” I hear his footsteps already…

Hipster Racist
Guest

What a stupid thing to say, considering that I have already, on this very board, made that same suggestion. I even mentioned the mutual insurance model that was common in an earlier era in America.

Catiline_Conspirator
Guest

I’m I on your list now, Hip? BTW, I’ve been looking for a comment of yours from way back but can’t find it. It had to do with the Five Eyes Alliance.If memory serves you said something like “Good, I’m all for it.” I want to use it for something I’m working on. If by chance you recall it, I’d appreciate it if you can locate it for me. Danke schon.

Hipster Racist
Guest

“List?” I have no idea what you are talking about.

Catiline_Conspirator
Guest

comment image

Hipster Racist
Guest

OK, so, you are a LARPer and do you constantly trash Americans and American culture?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Anyone who isn’t an Urban SWPL who goes to the Elks every Friday night is a Nazi Larper in his eyes…

Charles The Hammer
Guest

So if we can’t have a single payer system because we’re too diverse or too broke then how are we able to continue policing and babysitting the rest of the world? Why are we still giving billions to Israel every year? The globalist elites of the GOP have no problem wasting blood and treasure to benefit themselves and our so called “allies”. They disgust me just as much as the Democrats.

WR_the_realist
Guest

If we stopped all foreign wars we still wouldn’t be able to afford free health care for people. We might be able to actually balance the budget though. That would be nice. Unfortunately the one thing Trump really wants to spend money on is playing Globocop.

Charles The Hammer
Guest

How do you know? We spend trillions on babysitting and policing the world. What proof do you have that if we gave that up we still couldn’t have a single payer system like Canada?

Krafty Wurker
Guest

All TrumpCare does is shore up the failing ObamaCare for the insurance corporations who profit from it.

We know that the interests of the insurance corporations, are not our White American interests. If anything the insurance corporations work against White Americans. Just look at insurance corporation advertising, or their social spending agendas.

Trump and the Republicans want the insurance corporation political money and support. That’s why they are so hot to do TrumpCare. Just think of those tens of thousands of insurance agents out their pounding the TrumpCare message.

Catiline_Conspirator
Guest

Who is it that that has traditionally dominated the insurance industry, Krafty?

Krafty Wurker
Guest

Gee wizz, could it be the same people who dominate the hedge funds, and investment banking?

Catiline_Conspirator
Guest

Do (((they))) control insurance all by themselves, or is another tribe involved?

Krafty Wurker
Guest

That’s a tough question, that would require some research. To dominate is one thing, to control is another. To identify the controlling interests?

In general from what I’ve seen insurance company advertising promotes the anti-White agenda, and their social spending does too. When was the last time you heard of an insurance company doing anything for White Americans besides taking their money?

Diversity Heretic
Guest
One other factor is the adaptation that takes place to an existing system, even, or perhaps especially, to a bad system. People have made their best bargain with the present system and any change threatens those bargains. So, while it might be easy to design a reasonable health care deivery system from the ground up, trying to implement one on an installed base is more difficult. In Europe, less and less medical care is covered by the government, except for the indigent, and more and more people buy private insurance to supplement their government coverage. There are two other factors… Read more »
Jarod
Guest

Socialized healthcare can’t work if half your population are parasites.

Ozymandias
Guest

I didn’t think the Jews were that large of a demographic…

Cynic
Guest

If we define a parasite as someone who takes more from the system than he contributes 50% isn’t that far off.

Ike35
Guest

LOL!

Evola-Chan
Guest

More Esoteric Healthcareposting

From Ohio
Guest

Trump should have tied this immigrations, but certain Republican (((interests))) would never allow it.

Daniel
Guest
There is also this stupid belief among the alt-right that universal healthcare will work perfectly in a homogenous society but the entire system relies on importing third world cretins to control costs. Not very many people would want to go school and make the kinds of sacrifices a doctor makes to get paid in order to live in an apartment and drive a small effete car like they do in Europe. Also, trying to apply this model in America wouldnt work unless you address the particulars that apply in America. Unlike Europeans American doctors have to deal with alot more… Read more »
A hymn to Hermes
Guest

We basically already have universal healthcare. No one can be turned away. We just don’t have single-payer so the pay structure is absurd. You are already subsidizing those who can’t and won’t pay.

If you want a capitalist healthcare system then those who don’t have financial resources to pay for service must be turned away for even basic care and medical practitioners who give out finite resources (including their own time) for those who can’t pay must be punished. Good luck with that.

Ozymandias
Guest

That’s because it’s a socialist idea trying to function within a capitalist state.

Universal healthcare can only work effectively inside a socialist, or at least socialist-style, state.

JosephtheGreat
Guest

It is completely dumb to assume most people become doctors in order to live in mansions and drive big cars. I highly doubt their motives to do all that work is so shallow. Instead I assume most people become doctors because they want to help people and they like the work.

DaveMD ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗᴰʳ
Guest
DaveMD ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗᴰʳ

Most don’t (and those are unreasonable expectations in medicine anyway, at this point, unless one practices in a semi-rural area). However, I think the majority of those training in medicine expect to make enough to not have to worry about penny-pinching at the grocery store, be able to afford schools for their children, and have enough investment capital to make up for the opportunity cost of medical school and residency training.

Charles The Hammer
Guest

I certainly don’t want a doctor whose in it solely for the money. Typically people who are in a profession solely for the money cut corners and do a shitty job because they have no passion for it.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Yeah, someone with the aptitude needed to be a Doctor can make way more money in fields like Engineering.

Daniel
Guest

You’re pretty slow if you don’t think aspiring physicians don’t respond to incentives like normal people. Have fun being treated by a Nurse practioner and Artificial intelligence program.

Hipster Racist
Guest

Of course doctors respond to incentives. But you are pretending that doctors can only be paid well in a faux-“capitalist” system, which of course isn’t true. Under “socialism” doctors can be the top paid profession, have the biggest houses and the fanciest cars. It depends on what the society values.

JosephtheGreat
Guest

Of course they respond to incentives but maybe their incentive is more than money. Does Richard Spencer do all of his advocacy because the paycheck or is there more to life then that?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Europeans don’t live in apartments and drive Skodas because of public health care. Europeans have smaller houses and cars because Europe is more densely populated than America. You can also witness this in NYC or San Francisco.

Daniel
Guest

A doctor in Europe is much more likely to live that way which is my point. Quality of care will decline because the best and brightest will opt to do something else. Why be a surgeon when you could just be a parasite in management or some other bullshit with substantially less effort?

craicher
Guest

Wrong. People will be doctors for the status and because they care and are inclined that way and those are the people we need to be doctors not selfish people who do it just for the money. They have plenty of doctors in Russia, Ukraine and such places where the pay is very low.

Believe it or not money is not the motive for everyone.

JosephtheGreat
Guest

WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO DO SOMETHING IF THEY AREN’T GETTING PAID LOTS OF MONEY? IT MAKES NO SENSE! MONEY IS THE ONLY IMPORTANT THING IN LIFE!

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Doctors live in apartments in Manhattan too. I don’t see where you’re going with this analogy.Plenty of countries have government backed health care and their medical system is fine. For those who wanted Cadillac level health care, they could be given the option of paying for it themselves.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

A single payer system can be designed to ensure there’s enough personnel and resources, like free tuition for anyone who wants to go to medical school and subsidies to firms for medical equipment manufacture, etc. We subsidize billionaires buying condos, we can surely subsidize useful production.

Daniel
Guest

They have long wait times, near zero innovation, and rely on foreign labor. Also, you’re not going to get European or Canadian level of functionality. You will get VA/military level of care which is atrocious.

If you want to die from a Nigerian nurse while waiting on your Hindu doctor be my guest. It’s not going to end up like you or Spencer imagine it.

craicher
Guest

Very funny. In nations where a doctor makes survival wages like China or Eastern European nations they have plenty of doctors. In nations where doctors are paid like pashas they have to import those Hindus and Niggerians you speak of.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest
I lived in Italy for five years. They have a better health care system than the United States by every metric. If the Italians can create a more efficient and equitable health care system, it can be done in the US so long as there is the political will to do so. The US also has more real resources than Italy. Innovation has nothing to do with rent extracting parasites (health insurers). They don’t provide care, nor do they innovate. Most innovation in pharma and the medical fields are a result of government R&D and grants. As long as health… Read more »
Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

We have third world nurses and Hindu doctors in America too. See my post below, I don’t think Euro level health care is feasible at all in America.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

My cousin is physician in Naples. I didn’t see any Hindu doctors or nurses. I tore my ACL there, had it reconstructed, and all I saw were white people. Italy is a little different in that they haven’t drank the multicultural/multiracial Kool-Aid. It’s one of the most hostile countries to migrants from MENA – and even parts of Eastern Europe.

Ike35
Guest

But they sure like landing there and shitting in the streets.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

And Naples is one of the poorer parts of Italy as well. We have lots of Filipino nurses and Hindu doctors in America.

craicher
Guest

Every Western nation is suffering from the same malaise. Sweden, Ireland, the UK, the USA are all flooded with turd world (fake) doctors and nurses while the poorer White (and Asian) nations seem to do just fine producing their own. You know the story, these are jobs Americans (and Western Europeans) just won’t do.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

Yeah, they have a lower GDP per capita in the south. Ironically, the south, before unification, used to be wealthier than the north of Italy. Things have also gotten progressively worse for all of Italy when they adopted the Euro and joined the EMU.

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest
Health care in America is failing because America itself is failing. Heterogeneous, blood and soil nations like Japan or Finland have high levels of social trust. Consequently, health care for the poor and social welfare are seen as being necessary to help poor people who think, look and act like wealthier taxpayers. America is a garbage heap with low levels of social trust and cohesion. Wealthy women sign up for parenting classes with other yuppie moms because they don’t feel safe just taking toddlers to the park. Health care will never be fixed in America because America lacks the racial… Read more »
grumpiertrucker
Guest
Nonsense. Somalia has tremendous racial unity. Try to find decent healthcare there. And blacks here overwhelmingly back Single Payer. It’s whites who know Single Payer will leave them powerless to get quality care they could afford but won’t be around after the Government takes it over….. while illegals and minorities get the care they can’t or won’t afford… that have prevented a Government seizure of health care. And I find your Avatar especially amusing as there is one group or tribe of people that controls ALL the media in this country. And it’s that media that is constantly trying to… Read more »
Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Somalia fails because Somalis are stupid people, on average. Japan and Finland succeed because Japanese and Finns are smart people, on average.

If you took the time to read my post, you’d understand that I said single payer will never work because America is a multi-racial empire.

And sorry, I don’t think it takes Jewish scheming to get Whites and Blacks at each other’s throats. Ethnic conflict is as old as the hills.

grumpiertrucker
Guest
No, you didn’t say single payer will never work because America is a multi-racial empire. Here’s the quote: “Health care will never be fixed in America because America lacks the racial unity to enact government backed health care.” No mention of single payer. And no mention of a multi-racial empire. Instead, a useless bromide, “we lack racial unity.” And I did read every word of your post several times. And ethnic conflict is not the same thing as racial conflict. Two totally different things. Somalia is a mess because of ethnic conflict, but they have racial unity. And according to… Read more »
Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Government backed health care= Single payer. Stop autistically parsing each word. Somalia sucks because its full of East Africans. I obviously did not mean that every racially unified society can have a government health care scheme. To accomplish functional government health care requires a high IQ population, something that is lacking outside Europe and East Asia.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

Single payer = socialized insurance + for-profit providers.

Obamacare/Romneycare/Heritage Foundation market-based LOLZ = for-profit insurance + for-profit providers.

Zero payer = socialized insurance + socialized providers.

grumpiertrucker
Guest

Beautiful. You should work on Wall Street. Socialize the risk but privatize the profits! Are you Jewish?

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

I’m Italian.

It’s just that people get confused over the various types of universal health care systems. Single payer isn’t “socialism”, it’s a financing mechanism more than anything else.

grumpiertrucker
Guest
No, Government backed healthcare does NOT mean Single Payer. I’m not parsing anything. See, you’re making my point. You don’t know the basic terms you use and then get frustrated when others point this out to you. We currently have Government backed Health Care. It’s law that Employers provide coverage. It’s law that insurance companies get to monopolize. It’s law to have mandatory minimum coverages. HMO’s, Hospital Administrators and Insurance companies all must function not according to any market, but purely by Government edict. That’s my point. All our healthcare problems are a RESULT of Government Backed healthcare. But now… Read more »
Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

You go on and on about Jew lies and cite Ayn Rand…HAHAHAHAHAHA!

Yup, I had you pegged….LOLbertarian for sure.

craicher
Guest

You mean the Jewess Ayn Rand? The one who created Bolshivism for Americans? Well now we know where you get your destructive ideas from.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

There’s no such thing as a free market, we have competitive markets.

Ayn Rand was shitty novelist and even worse pseudo-intellectual.

grumpiertrucker
Guest
Two Left Wing talking points you’ve been taught to repeat. This is what the Alt-Right is producing? Leftist talking points? For the sake of this discussion, we are using “Free Market” as a counter-point to “Government Control/Instrusion/Interference.” But thank you Mr. Literal Guy. And Ayn Rand’s novels have been best sellers for decades and have had hundreds of pressings. I challenge you to read any of them without a dictionary handy. You haven’t read them, have you? I figured. GET THIS ALL THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS: THE ALT-RIGHT WILL NEVER SUCCEED WHILE IT INTERNALIZES AND ACCEPTS THE LEFT’S PREMISES AND… Read more »
craicher
Guest

Your hero was a jewess and I think you are not White.

Rocco Manzardo
Guest
There hasn’t been a “free market” since humans were hunter gatherers. Once city-states formed, we entered the realm of political economy. The Alt-Right really needs to get red pilled when it comes to macroeconomics, money and banking, labor theory, the history of political economy, public choice theory, etc. The Austrians and assorted libertarian economic theories are nonsensical at best. The idea of an economy operating independently of government and political institutions is a clear-cut utopia. It’s not possible, and any efforts to do so are doomed to fail and create dystopian consequences. Look at the last three decades of neoliberal,… Read more »
craicher
Guest

who are you if we are “you people”?

grumpiertrucker
Guest
I’m a Right Wing white boy seeing the displacement/extermination of my race in every country on Earth. Frustrated that allegedly dangerous “Alt-Right” guys are spouting the Jew talking points that the Free Market doesn’t work and that the only solution in Healthcare is for Jews who control the Government to take control of it so it will work for white people. You believe the Free Market is unfair only because of Jew lies. You believe that Single Payer works best only because of Jew lies. But now you scary guys are convincing yourselves and others that with regards to Healthcare,… Read more »
Cynic
Guest

In a free-market individualistic whites who compete with each other will be dominated and exploited by collectivist out-groups who co-operate with each other.

craicher
Guest

A boy or a man? Jews are a powerful faction in the USA. They do not control the government. They influence (corrupt) it.

Jews do, as a group, as a collective, as a group evolutionary strategy, what is best for the Jews. The radical individualism of free market idolatry is not in our interests. End of story.

All civilizations need government. We just need one that

Rocco Manzardo
Guest

Do you mean “Jew lies” by the likes of Murray Rothbard and Ludwig von Mises?

Yehudah Finkelstein
Guest

Sounds like another LOLberterian.

grumpiertrucker
Guest

See Below.